Sorry if this is the wrong section, mods please move if needed.
I’m currently looking to get out of my home garage and move into a shop. my biggest concern is the resin smells… Are you guys working out of our house? for those who have a shop, do you know what your shop is zoned for? ie 4a, i2, etc
any tips/techniques on how to prevent your neighbors from complaining? (if you are in close proximity)
Im in south africa, so can’t help you with zoning, but I use epoxies that smell very little, so no complaints from neighbours yet. Just for that benefit it is worth the cost to me.
Vacuum infusion helps even more, keeping most of the harmful vapours away from you.
Good luck with your shop.
Regards
Face it, you live in the land of “what’s my neighbor doing”. I would find out what industrial purposes are allowed in your zoning because it’s almost certain someone will complain if you are putting out a lot if chemical smells.
I have a shop in my house, one reason in use epoxy instead of polyester, but I do have a big ventilator and the shop is partitioned from the rest of the house.
lol youre right, south africa doesnt help ahaha.
I do a mix of infusion and wet lay up… I dont strictly work on composites so im not TOO concerned, but trying to get a feel.
I work on mostly car parts and i havent switched to epoxy yet bc of the heat capabilities… I’ve actually been looking to switch to VE resin for their higher heat distortion proprieties.
but then again i have a few gallons of epoxy… for some reason i never liked using epoxy. i feel like it doesnt cure as strong? (im using uscomposites brand)
I have not used VE much. In fact, only for one job. But just from the tech sheets, a decent structural epoxy has much better strength properties then any VE I have access to.
My parts are stiffer and much more resilient to stress and impact with epoxy than VE.
Only thing I like about VE is that it is usually more clear than epoxy, but I use SP115 epoxy for cosmetic parts that doesn’t have a yellow tint, so I don’t use anything other than epoxies these days. Oh, and brushes clean easier with VE than epoxy, but I buy cheap brushes and throw them away, so not really a concern for me.
There are also some nice high temp epoxies out there, but will definitely need post cure.
Try a structural specific epoxy, I’m sure you will like it.
Regards
If you switch to Epoxy you’ll have less smell… I used to have a shop in CA and had the shop vented to the top of the building. Didn’t have a problem but thats probably because I was in an industrial boat building zone.
The smell is a real issue when you ve/poly resins even for mould making etc. I am based in the UK and have had hell in my premises, i know the output is well below the permissible level but once people complain that does not matter.
Chris
www.carbonfibreworks.co.uk
I have a 24" turbine fan atop my roof attached to my spray booth that constantly vents my pails of resin and helps aid consistent temps.
On days that a mold is opened up or on mixing days, I open the booth door and leave it open till I can walk into the shop and not smell ANYTHING.
My business neighbors appreciated that addition and my adjoining wall neighbors no longer smell mal-odors when they come in of a morning.
Just use epoxies and you should be good.
The only other stuff that really smells is the freekote or sealer. And those evaporate pretty fast so shouldn’t really travel too far. Just have good ventilation.
I started out of my garage and ended up with the city inspector dropping by based on neighbor complaints three times a week.
I moved into a 2000 sqft warehouse, but recently ended my lease and moved into a 3200 sqft warehouse.
The first one had close neighbors, which caused all kinds of problems. They hated the overspray on their cars, the smell, the mess from trimming outside, etc…
Now, I have no close neighbors and a big enough shop to have reduced the smells down to a minimum.
If you’re in south Florida, please feel free to stop by.
biggest tip: know the law and follow it.
first step, figure out what zones are suitable for you in your municipality. asking on a national forum won’t do you any good unless you find someone within your area. we don’t have 4a or i2 zones in my city. i’m currently in an A-2, which is industrial, but i’ve been in A-1 (light industrial) and C-2 (commercial) and have not had any problems. your city or county website will have a zoning section that lays out what is suitable in each zone. it will say something about the processing of raw materials or the assembly of finished parts. something of that nature. if you have doubts, call and talk to someone with the city and figure out the best zone for you (it’s their job to help you). don’t make assumptions about zoning.
second step, learn the fire code and follow it. most cities counties go off the international fire code (ICC IFC). they’ll make some minor revisions for their own needs, but the majority of it will be the same. there are sections in it that specifically say what is required for open and closed resin systems along with the maximum amounts you are allowed to lay up at any given time and the amounts you are allowed to store. memorize these things. i know i am allowed to lay up 5 gallons a day in an open system in my zone.
third step, get the appropriate fire safety equipment. get a fire safe cabinet, even if you don’t need one and keep your flammables in there. prepare MSDS notebook for all your flammable, hazardous, corrosive stuff. have a few more fire extinguishers than required. get a knox box installed. have a proper hazmat sticker on your front and back door.
fourth step, keep your shop CLEAN and safe.
when i moved into my very first shop many years ago, i used polyester resin and it smelled very bad in the hot arizona summer. i had a church a few doors down that complained to me a few weeks after i moved in. sure enough, the fire marshal came out and made a surprise visit a few days later. he came out, asked me what i was doing. i explained to him my processes. i made mention of the fire codes for the zone and that i was in and that i made sure i was following the law. i showed him my brand new fire cabinet, showed him all my MSDS and provided him with an additional copy.
he was impressed. we spent about 5 minutes looking at the safety of the shop, and about 30 minutes talking about cars and carbon fiber. i never had any issues with complaints since.
bottom line: if you’re in the correct zone and you follow the rules, people can bitch and moan about the smell all they want, but it won’t matter. you can tell those people to xxxx right off. knowing the law and having a safe and clean shop will show any inspector that you’re not an idiot and you take your job seriously.
people worried about smells shouldn’t have warehouses or churches or whatever else in heavy industrial/manufacturing zones. that’s the whole point of zoning laws. to keep shops that do dirty, smelly, messy stuff where they belong.
really? trimming outside and overspray on people’s cars? i’d be pissed too.
Yeah, I can’t say I blamed them either, but I offered to personally move their cars out of their parking spots when we sprayed, then to move them back when we were done.
I also offered to have their cars detailed.
It turned out, they were more interested in complaining than being good neighbors. They kept telling me “we shouldn’t have to move” which is true, but if they’d asked me, I’d have moved in an effort to help accommodate the fact that NOT spraying is stopping them from operating their business.
They didn’t give sh!t one about me being able to pay the rent.
do you not have a booth? are you just spraying pieces outside?
what about spraying at night when no one is around? that is what i usually did before we got a booth.
That’s what we ended up doing, but the complaints just kept coming.
It’s all gelcoat for carbon infusion, so we didn’t spray it inside for fear of the gelcoat contaminating the paint booth.
We moved to a new, larger, facility and it’s been a night and day difference.
This thread needs far more photos.
It is important to mention to those opening up shops for the first time, or even third or fourth time that handling your work practices professionally and with common courtesy to business neighbors etc., will help all of us in the end.
It does so because your not leaving a bad experience to the landlords which say yes or no to you getting a new lease.
I can’t think of the number of times I’ve been shop hunting and when asked the business details and I say ‘Composites’, the first response is often, " Oooops,no way, not here, sorry sir".
When I explain that I work with closed molded techniques and do no outdoor work, its often over their grasp and the answer is still “no way”.
This effect is created by tenants spraying,sanding etc. out of doors and alienating other tenants along with the pungent smells of resins which tend to give most people head aches or even nausea…particularly women that are pregnant or elders on oxygen.
Make shop spaces capable of handling tasks like sanding,spraying, grinding and resin storage.
Anything dusty need to be under good air movement and collection. Anything smelly needs adequate air movement up and out of the roof-Above 20-25’ from ground height when possible.
I keep all my odiferous resin pails,hardeners and activators in a closet with a 14" turbine fan to constantly remove odor that would be too stout by morning when others arrive.
I keep all my explosive chemicals in a stainless steel cabinet to appease the fire dept. I keep two fire extinguishers up to date and in plain sight mounted to the wall chest high.
I use high volume vacuum collectors with vented hoods to stop dust travel.
Sweep up twice a day minimum and never leave solvent rags laying out.
There is still many more things left to mention, but you get the idea.
Be a Pro or go get a job until you know what being a Pro consists of…don’t leave a trail of BS for the rest of us to correct later.
Thanks guys, those were some really good responses and great tips from those with experience.
Is there some sort of filter that can pull air out of the shop but trap the “odors” as it leaves the building so the neighbors wont complain?
IE like the full respirators- When i wear it i cant smell the fumes at all. So my thought is, if you use a filter like that, somewhere in the process of drawing air out of the building, couldnt you minimize the smell so the neighbors wont complain?
Filter-wise, there are readily available pre-filters and charcoal panel filters which work great to contain odors prior to venting from your shop.
I built a 8’x8’ false wall with about a 12" space between it and the actual pre-existing shop wall and ordered off of ebay the needed metal wire filter holders. My rooftop turbine vent is ducted to this false wall or closet space.
The turbine fan in the roof top spins via air movement from heat along with rooftop wind and pulls constantly the odors from the work space.
thats exactly what i was thinking of! can you post a pic?
I work in a pharma plant as a maintenance tech. we use a lot of Ethel Acetate and ethanol for cleaning stainless steel dies. If anyone know how strong that stuff is you will understand. all of our rooms are a closed loop room where the air circulates
We use 2x4’ hepa filters and they take all the smell and particles out of the air. From my experience theses smells are stronger than any resin I have worked with and the hepas never let us down. Granted they are by no means cheap.
You can find them through suppliers who sell clean room supplies and accessories
I have one hepa unit in my garage and the difference is night and day. its a 25x32x8 garage and it will fume up quick, But with the unit running there is no respirator needed. Its also a high CFM system
Hope this helps also if you cannot vent outside like we cant