problem
had some failed attemps with infusion and finally found the problems.
-resin viscosity is around 400 finally got info from suppier. he said thats what they use for infusion!!! brand (TMR 511 MV)?
heated it up with heat gun and it still won’t saturate all the fibre?
size 12"X12" CF 10.5 oz 2XTWILL 2 layers glass, VER 50/50 fibre resin weights and thats with 2 layers flow media 3/4 of the way.
would you think that I should use more resin?
to compesate for the extra in the cup so you don’t suck up air after the resin.?
What’s your vacuum level before the infusion? A 1 ft square piece should take very little time to infuse, even with a 400 cps resin viscosity - IF - you have a high vaccum (28"Hg or more).
Before the resin is let in there are no leaks and iam pulling 25-28hg
and after all resin is in and hose is clamped it will go down to 29-30hg
hose is 1/4
last time ,part of the problem was to much catylyst
the fibre that got infused looks beutiful, but it only covered 3/4of the fibre…
What’s the gel time for this resin system? Is it kicking off before it fully infuses? I agree that you should run some test parts using fiberglass before you waste $ ruining more carbon.
What type of vacuum bag are you using? I was messing around with this high stretch stuff and it was a total waste. The stuff stretched so much that it prevented the resin from flowing using a surface media. In regards to the incomplete wet out, Andre (the king of infusion) has a section of his training course where he goes through a problem just like this. Essentially, you cut a whole big enough to insert a new feed line/flow media if not there already and then put a new patch over this whole. I have tried this with some limited success, but mostly ended up starting over because there was incomplete adhesion between the new and old resins. With the 12" by 12" where did you place the feed line? Middle? End? Sides? Where was the vacuum? Other guys chime in, but I think that flows with stacked carbon fiber not using a core flow material and just a surface media are about in the 8" to 9" efficiency range. The resin front starts to slow a lot after that. Epoxy will give you more working time but some can have a higher viscosity than VE. Anything below 500 cps should be good for infusion with the lower the better. If you heat the epoxy remember that it will cool pretty quickly if there is a big temperature difference between it and the mold temp.
High stretch bagging material is not good for infusion - it counteracts the surface media by filling in the voids that aid resin flow.
I’m working on a part that’s 24" long by 10" wide and I can infuse in the long direction in about 10 minutes or less with 300 cps epoxy viscosity. The laminate has several layers of unidirectional carbon parallel to the flow. The other layers are plain weave carbon. I have no experience with VER so I can’t help troubleshoot using that resin system.
Are you using spiral tubing and does it contact the infusion media to distribute the resin along a defined flow front?
the bag streching to much sounds good. The bag really got sucked down around the flow media so maybe.
Ill have to find out the ply of plastic Iam using from the supplier. I allways have trouble getting spec.s on stuff.
Iam using 1layer 10.5 oz 2xtwill and 2layers plain weave glass
resin inlet is in the middle of one side and the vac is in the middle on the opposite sid on the edge of cf.
how do you up load pics and vids…I have it on vid if ya wanna see!!
no sprirell tubing, only for bigger sized projects
Are you using a flow media? Keep in mind that resin will only travel so far regardless of the viscosity. Play with it a little bit a learn how far the resin will travel using the exact plys of cloth that you are going to use on the part. Once you get this figured out, add more feed points to your layup to compensate for that.
The best way to infuse the part for the first time is to over do it. Install more feed point/line than you think you’ll need and then make your adjustments as you go along.
Evan, I’m doing around 60 parts that are 55" long and 10"" wide that the surface varies from “flat” to about a 1" occaisional" drop and rise". With your above description,is there a “rule of thumb” that applies say for about every 24" of a piece for the number of “infusion inlets” ?
Or is EVERY part just something we each have to master as our own as we go ?
Question #2, is the diameter of infusion inlet hose to be smaller when MORE are added or is this also a variable ?
ALso, is there a “better than not” area to place the series of infuse tubes ? For example,for multiple feeds,have the first of course at one end of the mold and the second in the center ? ( or on an upper edge,near flange) ? Or does it help to simply “stagger” their positions until the flow gets its fastest saturation ?
Rule of thumb, generally speaking, is to not depend on the resin to have to travel more than 18". So I guess 36" is the max you should go between feed points. This figure was made up when infused without a flow media. So your traveling distance is going to increase with flow media and flow channels. With your 55" x 10" part for example, the best way to do it IMO is to have your suction at the middle and have one feed point at each end of the mold so that the resin can start on the ends and meet at the mid point. Did I ever send you the instructional DVD?
[quote=“Evan”]Rule of thumb, generally speaking, is to not depend on the resin to have to travel more than 18". So I guess 36" is the max you should go between feed points. This figure was made up when infused without a flow media. So your traveling distance is going to increase with flow media and flow channels. With your 55" x 10" part for example, the best way to do it IMO is to have your suction at the middle and have one feed point at each end of the mold so that the resin can start on the ends and meet at the mid point.){/quote}
Makes perfect sense !!Tube diameter important really ?
( Did I ever send you the instructional DVD?
No, didn’t recieve it with the last order ? Maybe with the balance order ? 8)
Vinny
I am useing 2 layers of flow media, I think the plastic is streching onto fibre,restricting flow. also to much cytylist, last time
ver is over the 400cps, I keep getting the wrong stuff, suppier dosen’tknow the specs even, had the manufacture send me the specs.
Do you mix extra resin so when the resin is nearly gone you clamp hose so not to suck air?
It could be the stretch bag although I can’t be sure. I’ll check the PM shortly. You should always clamp off the line before air starts to enter. That doesn’t necessarily mean you have to mix more than you’d need to.
The larger the feed tube the faster the resin can enter the laminate. Does it travel further also? I don’t think it’s neccessarily so. I only use big tubes for big laminates so I don’t end up wasting as much resin that collects in the tube. I’ll send you the DVD this weekend.
Converging my molds (all 3) as you had mentioned, is done and I think it will really speed up production and keep the CF weave much straighter. I’m glad too as this will speed up overall plug making for the other repeat molds.
