Here’s a good video showing the composites shop at Koenigsegg including some of their aluminum molds which are really nice.
[ame=“http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=504I_hJDFck&list=UU5rBpVgv83gYPZ593XwQUsA&index=1”]Carbon Fiber - Inside Koenigsegg - YouTube[/ame]
Regarding the tube & mold that the owner was showing us in the video - where the join in carbon is (where the 2 pieces of the molded parts meet), is that seam not a weak area? Surely it’s only the resin holding the part together as there are no overlapping layers of carbon?
Or does that not matter too much as it’s not a stressed part?
.kyle,
I’ve made similar tubes and there is a composite overlap on the inside where the two halves join together… it just wasn’t shown in the video.
The video didn’t show the exact layup schedule for that tube in question. What the owner was showing us was just the basic system of pre-preg and additional layers, stressing the fact that quality professional composite work isn’t just some quick deal that anyone can do, but rather there is engineering and A LOT of planning involved.
Love the video, love the car!
One question I had was the comment the owner made with regards to the Koenigsegg being the most composite intensive automobile to manufacture… I would question this with regards to Pagani… I would have assumed that Zonda is just as, if not more, composite intensive as the current Koenigsegg.
What are the forums thoughts?
-Corban
It’s unbelievable how many parts in a Koenigsegg are made of carbon. Just a feeling, but I would say much more than in a Zonda.
DDC,
I appreciate and value your input… the Koenigsegg is a work of art.
-Corban
I would think that both Pagani and Koenigsegg have similar amounts of composites in their cars. Where I think they differ is cosmetic carbon. Some Pagani’s have entire bodies of exposed carbon where the Koenigseggs appear to have their bodies largely covered with some sort of surface coat. The care that Pagani takes laying up major body components is ridiculous; the level of attention to detail to achieve this really cool to see.
Pagani = Mostly art coupled with speed
Koenigsegg = Less artistic but still awesome
Here’s a Pagani video - [ame=“http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fz4KBh5I4WE”]Behind the Scenes at Pagani - DRIVEN - YouTube[/ame]
Thanks Corban.
How would the overlap be achieved though if the prepreg in the video is trimmed to the edges of the mold surface and then it’s vacuumed (as opposed to an inflatable bag used to press against the mold)? I’ll blame it on being tired, but I just can’t work out how it’s done.
I hope they show in one of the following episodes how that cylinder head looking part is made.
It’s nice that the owner is letting the behind the scenes stuff to be filmed. He seems like a great guy. Much respect to him.
I saw a zonda roadster and a zondaR…speechless, no words to describe them
I think that koenigsegg has more parts than pagani…the differences are intake plenum, intake tubes and camshaft cover…the other main parts are for both made with CF. If I remember right, koenigsegg used carbon fibre wheels, or has tested them, pagani not
.kyle,
There would be a basic two ways of making the tube in question, and your thought of disbelieve is correct… if the pre-preg is trimmed at the part line of both molds, then there isn’t anything to hold the halves together (this is a correct thought).
The truth behind the part however is that either one side overlaps behind the other, or both halves are trimmed to the part line but additional strips are applied behind the seam before bagging and curing (which wasn’t discussed in the video and was where it is misleading).
Some of aspects of composites require to be very engineered and technical… while other aspects are just common sense. It was your common sense that told you the two halves wouldn’t be strong the way the video described… and you’re correct!
-Corban
Excellent. Thank you kindly Corban!
Both Pagani and Koenigsegg offer bare carbon finishes, but the koenigsegg chassis is far more technically advanced structure being stiffer and lighter, and the huayra has CrMo structures front unlike the koenigsegg, and not to mention that it uses a “Carbotanium” structure just to add weight and weaken it(is that what you mean by art?)
Pagani is more about being flashy and less about the ultimate supercar.
Cyclone,
Welcome to the forum and for your first post with regards to these two amazing vehicles. I appreciate your outlook on the situation. Personally (my opinion) Pagani has created a cultural shifting artfully crafted masterpiece, its just that my heart flutters at the mention of their products.
I have been birthed into a life of exotic cars… primarily Lamborghini’s with an occasional Ferrari and Porsche. It is just something about Pagani that has “given my composites a purpose” if you will.
This isn’t to discredit Koenigsegg in anyway, they make a fantastic engineering marvel, extremely well built vehicle.
I think Richard Hammond from Top Gear UK puts it correctly… Pagani has won the heart of those that look upon it, it has won the award of being the new “pin up car” of the modern day, just as the Countach was of the 80’s, Pagani is of today.
Never the less, this topic is about the Koenigsegg and their amazing composite skills, which they clearly have mastered.
-Corban
Thank you Corban
I guess my first post was a bit serious compared to my usual character. Being an engineering student(final year, luckily) I tend to see beauty is efficient design with my favorite car being the Mclaren F1, what an amazing piece of kit.
The Pagani is a bit too brazen for me personally, but with that being said, they do every thing with flair, and on looks it certainly has the Koenigsegg licked.
Regards
Thank you Corban
I guess my first post was a bit serious compared to my usual character. Being an engineering student(final year, luckily) I tend to see beauty is efficient design with my favorite car being the Mclaren F1, what an amazing piece of kit.
The Pagani is a bit too brazen for me personally, but with that being said, they do every thing with flair, and on looks it certainly has the Koenigsegg licked.
Regards
I’m quite sure that the last or the last two layers are a bit oversized and then when the mold is already closed, they insert those oversized layers and overlap across previous layers(which with pre-preg CF isn’t so complicated).
P.S. very interesting tooling for CF plennum!
Very attractive video and very attractive car also
But I’m asking myself to make this tube and other parts they don’t use bladder but they are doing an inside vacuum and this I cannot figure out the process???
If somebody know and did it I’m sure me and others would really like to know How and the benefit of it. Thanks
To this point ^^
When they trim the Prepreg edges in the tubes mold, they only flush trim one side leaving the opposing side with about 1/4-1/2" lip. Done the opposite for each mold half.
Once carefully placed atop each other then bladder bagged they will bond securely upon autoclave heat. Very slick method. Super nice tools.
I love both The Koeniggsegg and Pagani line of cars so much. Watch as other manufacturer’s even in the domestic range begin to copy methods for production.Its already happening.